I see the light!

[potofsoup]

After a bunch of convos with various people in the comment threads of the Reblogs, redux and explaining tumblr reblogs post, I've realized 2 really big things:

1) When I say "reblog", I'm referring to the motivation behind hitting the reblog button on tumblr, which is "sharing other people's content that you're excited about", which on DW, usually results in a link and a blurb. To reblog is to share and to hype. BUT, when everyone else reads the word "reblog", they think "oh, that thing where the entirety of my post is replicated on someone else's blog" and then they squint and say "isn't that reposting? my words are mine, dammit!"

2) Apparently DW commenting norms are very different from what I thought! I'm used to either having a one-on-one conversation with a creator on AO3, or having a conversation with mutuals on my personal DW, where I know everyone. But apparently: For public posts, you can jump into existing comment threads between strangers the way you can reblog and add onto someone else's stuff.

For me, reblogging is the equivalent of going to my friends and saying "hey, check out this cool thing I found!", whereas jumping onto strangers' comment thread is the equivalent of butting into a group's conversation at a party, but APPARENTLY THAT'S OKAY?!! Whereas if I'm like "hey, check out this cool thing I found" and I include a bit of the actual thing, I might have the creator of the cool thing body-slamming me to the ground???

WOWZERS, THAT'S DIFFERENT.

On tumblr, it's totally okay to reblog and add onto some stranger's stuff and share it with your followers as long as you have proper linkage and attribution.

On DW, it's totally okay to jump into a conversation with a bunch of strangers and then link your followers to that conversation, as long as everything has the right privacy settings.

:O!!!!

Comments

[daphneblithe]

this is fascinating and also YESSS to being bodyslammed by the creator, that is fab. :D

[gingicat]

Well, there’s the convention of “hey, friend, you wrote this awesome public post, may I link to it?” And then the understanding is that anything shared should be discussed at the original location.

[havocthecat]

Which is a convention only some people hold to, tbh. Not everyone does.

[ironymaiden]

Thanks for working through this in a really civil and constructive way.

[perspi]

This has indeed been a fascinating discussion!

I need to be better about linking around on my own DW; I feel like I could post a few more things than I have in the past. Hm...

[eatingcroutons]

Hahaha, yeah that's definitely one thing that's different about journaling culture. I personally love getting into side conversations with people on comment threads anywhere. It's something I really missed on tumblr, where it's almost impossible to keep track of all the side conversations happening on a post.

[leveragehunters]

This echoes some of the thoughts I've been having, that the evolution of posts that we had on Tumblr (where they start at anteaters, progress through biologists, meander into sloth farts, march past geological formations and wind up at Steve's nipples) is something that's really better placed to happen in comments on DW, rather than the 'reblogging by taking chunks of a post and adding onto it' method.

Then we can reblog, ie link to, the comment threads and marvel at the wonder of conversational evolution :D

[potofsoup]

Yeah. I feel like this has been a good conversation that has clarified some of the commenting and linking norms for me. And it was an ... 75% invigorating and 25% stressful experience for me.

This got long--I hope you don't mind!

[umadoshi]

Having just finally caught up on reading a bunch of comment threads (yay for conversation!), I want to note a couple of things (especially since I get an excuse to use my Tumblr icon ^_-).

1) To be clear, I really like and appreciate all of the work you've been doing in writing about DW to help new(er) users get comfortable. It's truly awesome. ^_^

2) Speaking as someone whose Tumblr has essentially always been nothing but reblogging (I enjoy a lot of stuff about Tumblr, but have never liked it for actually saying anything), and who shares a lot of links here on Dreamwidth, which is my online home, I have to echo what some other people have been saying: to me, and to a lot of people who're very familiar with DW and Tumblr (and other sites), the actual term "reblog" is functionally just a Tumblr(/Pillowfort?) thing. Dreamwidth--and I mean the site, not just the culture, although the culture grew out of the functionality--doesn't work that way. I really think the word that will most accurately convey what you want it to here is just "link".

(My own approach when linking to other Dreamwidth posts is generally, is this person talking about meta or social issues or geeky/fannish stuff or [other not-terribly-personal thing]? Then linking is probably fine, if they don't have a note in a sticky post or their bio saying not to. If they're talking about/touching on their personal life, even if the post isn't locked, I ask first.)

3) And yes, insofar as there's a commenting "norm" here, it's that it's fine to join a conversation! ^_^ It won't always turn into its own subthread or anything, but sometimes it does, and it's also how a lot of people meet each other.

Obviously mileage varies somewhat, but I honestly can't think of ever seeing anyone grumble or get upset about having a stranger comment (other than if it was actively rude/hostile, or a situation where someone's talking about their love/enjoyment of something and somebody else barrels in to tell them/talk about what's bad about that thing). Other than with stuff like that, the worst that's likely to happen if someone comments on a stranger's post/discussion is that the person they're commenting to won't have time to engage or have anything to say and it won't go anywhere.

(In case this is helpful to know: one thing that does vary a LOT here is that some people actively try to reply to every comment and others don't/can't, and both [or anything in between] are well within the norm. So a lack of response doesn't automatically indicate annoyance or whatever.)

(Sorry for how wordy this got, or if it feels like I'm over-explaining at you--I'm not always good at being concise, especially when exhausted. >.<)

Re: This got long--I hope you don't mind!

[potofsoup]

Thanks for the super helpful comment!

Yeah, I think the meaning of "reblog" is what is at stake here. I've always treated reblogging as an action that I take, as in "do I want to share this post with all of my followers?" Fwiw, I've gotten a number of "I reblogged your post here" comments over the past week, and all of them have just been links, so there is at least a contingent of people who use "reblog" the way I do.

[jamethiel]

Absolutely! I mean, people feel a lot more of a sense of personal ownership over what's considered their "Personal space" in their journal and--IDK. You'll run into jerks and people who are tetchy, but such is life. Check our their profile, if you're unsure and being super-polite you can say "May I link?" but mostly, if people post something publicly there's the default understanding that anyone can comment/find it.

And I personally love it when users meet each other and talk in my comments (so long as it's not hostile, obvs.) It's great! More people!

[ambyr]

2) Apparently DW commenting norms are very different from what I thought! I'm used to either having a one-on-one conversation with a creator on AO3, or having a conversation with mutuals on my personal DW, where I know everyone. But apparently: For public posts, you can jump into existing comment threads between strangers the way you can reblog and add onto someone else's stuff.

I would go beyond "you can" to "you are actively encouraged to." When I make a post (and all mine are f-locked, but I think the same principle applies), it's, hmm, kind of the equivalent of inviting people over for a party? Obviously I like it when people talk to me directly at my parties, but if all I wanted was to hold one-on-one conversations I'd just ask my friends out for dinner separately. For me the true sign of a successful party is when I can wander off to the kitchen to check on the brownies and come back and find my guests chatting amongst themselves, getting to know people they've never met before without me having to shepherd the conversation along. When I see people engaging in conversation with each other in the comments on my posts, I feel the same warm glow of satisfaction: I have created a hospitable environment for helping cool people find other cool people to talk to.

Extending the analogy possibly beyond all reasonable limits, having someone reblog content and shift the conversation elsewhere is kind of like coming back from the kitchen to find all my party guests have gone off to hang out with each other at the local bar. I'm left standing with a pan of brownies in my hand feeling abandoned. Even if they leave a note saying I can join them in their new venue, I'll still wonder what they thought was wrong with my house.

[potofsoup]

Thank you so much for your analogy! In this case, I think it comes down to me not actually enjoying entertaining in most social situations, then! When someone irl invites me to a party, I usually respond by saying "hey, can we meet for tea sometime?" And if I host a party, about an hour into it, I'm like "Oh no I can't leave this party b/c it's at my house." XD;;;;